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Officials: Tappan Zee Tunnel Not Practical

Thruway authorities note tunnel would be costly, congested

The proposed new Tappan Zee Bridge—expected to be complete by 2017 to the tune of $5.2 billion—was given the go-ahead after a tunnel option was deemed unsuitable, officials have said.

Experts studied the tunnel alternative before . The tunnel, officials said, would likely have consisted of five underground tubes, each with two lanes. Another tunnel option was one underground unit with two chambers.

The tunnel would have stretched seven miles and required "extensive shoreline and in-water work," reports said.

The concept was dismissed for a number of reasons, mainly due its cost and effect on the region's environment. Experts noted the tunnel "would take longer to construct at a higher cost," and the required bells-and-whistles—like ventilation—would impact nearby shorelines and swamps.

Another cardinal reason for its dismissal? An inability to accomplish its main goal—better transportation. Traffic flow would be often impaired, trucks would have trouble tackling steep grades and emergency vehicles would have longer response times, the report notes.

A tunnel would not allow for pedestrian and cycling paths either, a planned addition to the coming crossing. Some politicians want to take the plan further and , but Thruway officials and the Governor have yet to endorse the idea.

Still, the tunnel option retains supporters—mainly due to the possibility of reducing pollution. The Tappan Zee Bridge sees approximately 135,000 vehicles daily, and Richard Kavesh, Nyack's mayor, that transitioning that traffic underground would make for cleaner air.

Residents are also upset about the proposed bridge's lack of mass transit options. Although installing rail and bus lanes would just about triple the cost and bring the price tag to $16 billion, many Rocklanders .

"We do not want the bridge of 1955, but the bridge of 2055," said Jen Laird-White, Nyack's deputy mayor, at a . "It will be expensive, it will be difficult to achieve... but we need to bring back the money for mass transit."

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Barry Kornfeld November 2, 2011 at 12:54 pm
This is an absolute lie!!! No tunnel options were explored! The tunnel was dismissed without consideration. Just go back and check out the minutes of the meetings. The political chronies getting a bridge contract were clearly not versed in tunnel technology and that is why the idea of a tunnel was rejected. They are building tunnels all over the world! This is just a matter of contract payola for political lobyists. If they looked at the tunnel option then why is there no cost comparison! Certainly the environmental review would have been in support of a tunnel. Was a review even done. This is criminal the way it is being shoved down the throats of the tax payer. We had meetings and meetings and meetings and none of the discussed options were actually incorporated. When ever the tunnel option was mentioned it was dismissed without consideration.
Kevin Zawacki (Editor) November 2, 2011 at 02:26 pm
Hi Barry, thanks for reading & writing. Do you know where I can find a copy of the minutes?
Tammy Kay Kuiper November 2, 2011 at 05:54 pm
Not having mass transportation over the new bridge is a serious mistake in planning for the future. Lack of public transportation feeds increased traffic and congestion, does not service a segment of the population that does not use a car, and ensures an increase in pollution due to car traffic. It’s really the same mistake as before all over again...cheaper solution now for a more expensive fix (retro-fit) later. The fact that the plan also does not include what happens to the old bridge is more short-sightedness. The plan needs to be comprehensive and well thought out BEFORE work begins not after.
Ned Visser November 2, 2011 at 06:58 pm
I agree. Robert Moses always fought tunnels because they were less of a monument to his building prowess but there are many advantages to tunnel building especially an immersed tube tunnel
The main advantage of an immersed tube is that they can be considerably more cost effective than alternative options – i.e. a bored tunnel beneath the water being crossed (if indeed this is possible at all due to other factors such as the geology and seismic activity) or a bridge. Other advantages relative to these alternatives include: Their speed of construction Minimal disruption to the river/channel, if crossing a shipping route Resistance to seismic activity Safety of construction (for example, work in a dry dock as opposed to boring beneath a river) Flexibility of profile A tunnel would be much friendlier environmentally to both shores and rapid transit could just take the form of a parallel tunnel devoted soley to rail transit. It could be much cheaper to assemble and then float into place when complete. Where are the numbers that say a bridge is cheaper, especially since the bridge would probably have to be floated on pylons like the current one is. Most people don't know that the current bridge has a unique aspect in its design in that the main span is supported by eight hollow concrete caissons who's buoyancy is maintained by immense pumps that must be maintained and adjusted around the clock.
John Gromada November 2, 2011 at 08:02 pm
The tunnel option has been ruled out now for many years. Besides the costs and geographic impracticality, a tunnel would be an economic disaster for the Nyacks; because of topography and geology, the tunnel entrance would need to be in West Nyack, meaning we would lose exits 10 and 11, isolating our community from the Thruway. I'm sure many would say that's a great thing, but unfortunately our local economy now relies on those exits, and easy access to the Thruway.
John Gromada November 2, 2011 at 08:15 pm
The tunnel is a dead horse that's been beaten for years and years now, and was thoroughly studied in the EIS process. The big problem is there is 180 feet of silt on the west side of the river before you hit bedrock- you can't have a stable tunnel in silt. In order to get a road down to a tunnel as low as it would need to be at this section of the river, it would need to stretch from Elmsford to West Nyack, because of the grade. These facts have been out there for years.
John Gromada November 2, 2011 at 08:25 pm
Kevin's article states: "Although installing rail and bus lanes would just about triple the cost " This is very misleading- the bus rapid transit option would add under $3 billion to the cost of the bridge- about 45% more than the bridge without transit. They're trying using the most costly transit scenario to scare people into accepting a new bridge with no transit
E. Loughran November 6, 2011 at 07:09 am
A tunnel from West Nyack to Elmsford.....sounds great! Restores the village of Nyack to the resort-town destination it was historically. Keeping the current bridge as a pedestrian walkway would make it a tourist destination year round. Put a world- class (P. Kelly?) restaurant in the middle....Chesapeake Bay/Bridge did it. Develop our local economy around a re-imagined "village", known for its scenery, sailing, food & arts. Instead of traffic...performances: musical or theatrical, over the Hudson.
Isolating the community from the thruway could be the best thing to happen since the bridge was built. The current bridge could be maintained, only used by emergency vehicles...and maybe jitney service to the Tarrytown station. Start a pedicab business like the one in Time's Square. Loads of possibilities......
Mercedes Kent Ross November 16, 2011 at 05:08 pm
Why do they keep reminding us of the walk and bike path?? Is that what they are serving up instead of some sort of mass transit?
Chris November 16, 2011 at 10:46 pm
The BRP (Bus Rapid Transit System) does not work you do the full thruway corridor project. The thruway must be widened to its right-of-way limit. BRP stations and road and exit enhancements must be made as well. The cost of this is more then 3 billion. As with most mass transit systems. The system could be revenue self sustaining.
Note Article
Just a short thought to get the word out quickly about anything in your neighborhood.
Share something with your neighbors. Write a new post... What's up? Make an announcement, speak your mind, or sell something
Lisa Buchman (Editor) June 13, 2013 at 11:09 am
Congratulations to Nyack Boat Club and member Justin Coplan! Would love to see photos of the team inRead More action!
Aerial of United Water's proposed water treatment plant location
Caleb June 13, 2013 at 10:23 pm
Untrue. Perhaps if United Water wasn't sending over 2 million gallons a day from Deforest Lake toRead More they're customers in Bergen County we would not have this shortage. Hydrologists have shown that there is enough water regularly collected in Rockland's reservoirs and aquifers for our current and growing needs. Many of the "facts" that United Water is putting forward are outdated, and are based on they're own mismanagement of our water basin. Lets remember that United Water has repeatedly been removed as a water provider of major cities throughout this country (6+ last time I checked, notably even from Camden NJ) for mismanagement of water resources. I think its a prudent choice to look into a plant that we will be stuck paying for for the next 4 years from a company that has repeatedly lied and provided water with toxin levels high above legal limits to they're customers. Better safe than sorry.
John Taggart June 13, 2013 at 11:59 pm
Rockland has grown to the point that it needs more water. Terminating the flow of a river and takingRead More the water resources away from other communities (stealing what we need) isn't going to happen.
drostan June 19, 2013 at 03:13 pm
A Response to the Response Mr. Michael Pointing, writing on behalf of United Water, opined in theRead More Journal News (June 7) and the Nyack Patch (June 11) that an Issues Conference on the pending desalination project is unnecessary. When it is so greatly to his personal and professional benefit to support this project, how can he expect to be taken seriously? Comments on the "desal" plant have only rarely mentioned that the radioactive tritium, which each day leaks into the Hudson from Indian Point Nuclear Power Plant - just 3 miles upstream from the plant - will end up, in diluted form, in our drinking water. Problem is, although highly diluted, there's no way to filter out tritium since it is chemically identical to water. Worse, there's no known safe exposure level. Like "normal" water, tritium goes into your body as fast as you drink it. Good news: about half of the tritium you do drink is filtered out by the kidneys within about ten days. Bad news: When your kitchen faucet keeps providing you with small amounts of tritium day after day, it tends to keep whatever levels you have in your body elevated. Welcome to your future, Rockland. Say, how about cracking open a nice plastic bottle of Deer Park for mixing up that baby formula? Why does United Water want this project to go forward so quickly as to necessarily preclude a thorough public education process in which all the variables and all the options can be openly discussed? What if one day you decided you don't like UW anymore and you wished the water utility was still owned by the government and not the private sector, because at least that way through your vote, you could democratically elect new people who would shut the plant down (whereas you can never "vote out" a private corporation from owning the pipes that carry your drinking water)? Let's just say arbitrarily that for the first ten years following completion of this more or less irreversible project there was an average of 500 additional picocuries of tritium per liter showing up in drinking water in Rockland County that was not there before. Even the NRC says Indian Point emits tritium into the ground water and presumably into the Hudson as well, since Hudson water is what flows - 24 hours a day - into and out of the power plant, cooling the atomic reaction that creates electrical power). In 1976 the EPA decided (more or less arbitrarily) that 20,000 picocuries of radioactivity would be roughly the "safe" upper limit for human consumption (due to drinking tritium or any other radionuclide). I say "arbitrarily" because I am aware of no one who has actually tried this since then, to see if it really turned out to be safe. Whose insurance policy would make Rockland homeowners whole again if at some future point tritium (or other radionuclide) levels skyrocketed while property values plummeted? Maybe something so terrible could never, ever happen. I certainly hope it couldn't. But why are we residents the guinea pigs, and how come we pay more - not less - for our water just so UW can do more business and, of course, collect more in utility bills? By the way, Fukushima was also never ever supposed to happen. Human health is not something you go back and study all over again once you realize you've lost it. Doesn't Rockland County have enough cancer already? Dan Rostan Nyack